The problem with Survival will ALWAYS be that half of it's talents seem mandatory and without any talents the spec is barely functional.Mongoose bite NEEDS to be baseline, guerrilla tactics NEEDs to be baseline. Hell I feel sometimes Alpha Predator needs to be baseline too. I love survival, the idea of being a rugged monster hunter who traps and flanks an enemy is alot of fun. But Blizzard have for basically 2 expansions now shown they've given up on the spec. Legion's design had SOMETHING even if it was complex for little gain, but BFA and now Shadowlands have gutted it to the point where Survival has literally nothing the other hunter specs and other melee don't have.Here are changes that would make survival not only competitive against MM and BM but also other melee.1) make mongoose bite baseline, it's a unique mechanic no other melee class has, where we focus on quick windows of rapidly spamming an attack, while also trying to avoid dot drop off.2) Have wildfire bomb have 2 stacks baseline, it feels horrible leaving wildfire on CD but also feels horrible when you need to choose between a 5 stack mongoose bite or a wildfire bomb.3) Some form of group utility: I always thought a buff that increases resource generation by a percentage would fit, seeing as Survival hunters used to be one of the replenishment classes back in WotLK, or maybe find weakness returns as some kind of +crit debuff on the target.4) This is just a personal thing, but give us dual wielding for @#$% sake, Rexxar dual wields, even Nathanos Dual wields Give us our twin weapons like the obvious ranger class we are!5) Make active talents actually worth using; We already have plenty of active skills, so adding another button to the rotation should mean something, Murder of Crows and Chakrams are basically the same + Damage for focus skills and Flanking Strike is basically a second kill command. Maybe turn Flanking Strike into Talonstrike, especially if Mongoose bite is baseline.And finally, for $%^& sake, don't listen to anyone whining for more range, I don't want 3 specs of Hunter competing for the same niche, BM and MM already close to invalidate each other, the last thing we need is another BFA scenario where BM made MM entirely pointless to play.
I agree it would be fun to specialise in traps, slows etc etc - such as Snake Trap, Caltrops, Dragonsfire Grenade, Explosive Trap, Immolation Trap - would be pretty cool. The PvP talent that makes Tar Trap slow melee attackers attack speed would be a great one baseline to have for some group utility (especially with the new legendary to set your Tar Trap aflame).ALso agree 100% - Mongoose Bite should be baseline - bring back Fury of the Eagle to make the stacks mean something when you hit 5.
I mained survival in Wrath, but switched off in WoD. When it was made into a melee spec in Legion, it became my new main, and I absolutely LOVED it (and still do). I wish it wasn't gutted in BFA, though. I would take back the hectic, complex mess it could be in Legion over what we have now. Melee hunter is cool and fits right in beside both BM and MM.
Survival definitely needs attention, it didn't get any changes for Shadowlands. Many things could be done to make the spec more fun to play. I agree with most of what grenadier001 said, except making mongoose bite baseline, that could remain a talent, but in a more competing row.I gotta say though, changing it to be a dual wielding melee/ranged hybrid would be the most badass thing. I'm completely sold on that. Although obviously it should be less efficient at ranged.Dual axe throwing hunter, that would be cool. They wouldn't need to change the spec completely for that, besides making axe throwing animations. They would just need to make you able to auto-attack at ranged, but not able to raptor strike unless you use Aspect of the Eagle, which is already there. Or maybe your raptor strike is just a weaker version at ranged. Done.
Overall: Its still Meme tier :D
SV hunter is more beastmaster than bm specc itself
I don't know what your testing consisted of, but our findings differ wildly on certain things. A lot of this seems to be written with the BfA playstyle in mind, but a few key things have changed in Shadowlands.For one, Birds of Prey simmed horribly on all possible setups, for the obvious reason that without Blur of Talons, CA isn't really that strong a cooldown. Wildfire Infusion was significantly better, and even Chakrams was slightly ahead. Yes, it's that bad.Secondly, Viper's Venom also simmed badly, for the weird reason that Serpent Sting is actually good now. Since its duration was fixed to not be reduced by haste, we're meant to keep up 100% uptime anyway, as opposed to BfA where we ignored it unless we had a VV proc. So all you end up gaining from this talent is focus, but the focus you get from it vs Alpha Predator is minimal, and Alpha Predator also buffs KC.As for legendaries, Latent Poison's damage might be still on the low side, but due to the complete lack of a proper single-target legendary (I mean proper as in not the stupid Nesingwary's legendary that is indeed the best performer right now), it is the second best for single-target, narrowly beating Cluster. Soulforge Embers, after repeated nerfs, isn't that great anymore, and it's terrible to use because it requires you to waste 2 gcds to activate it. So I'm not sure where that suggestion comes from either.Lastly, regarding covenants, Night Fae outsimmed Kyrian in all my tests, for all specs, in both single-target and aoe, by a small but not negligible margin. Obviously the difference in cooldown means they might perform differently depending on fight length, and there is a case to be made in favor of Kyrian, especially for m+ where the short cooldown will allow you to do insane burst aoe twice as often. But it has to be mentioned that when it comes to pure damage, especially single-target, Night Fae is leading; and the difference between it and Kyrian grew larger as I simmed higher ilvl sets. All of this is not to say Kyrian is a bad choice, just that Night Fae is much better than the article makes it seem and they are both good options. People can then make their choice based on that. On the whole, I'd say the single-target damage is in need of a buff as the spec lagged slightly behind Marksman and BM in high gear levels, but thankfully the AoE, both burst and sustained, is as strong as ever. I definitely urge more people to try it out, it's a very fun spec that's still undeservedly ignored by the playerbase.
The survival melee treatment was a failed experiment. If you are going to completely give up on the spec please revert back to the old ranged one.
I'm having a blast playing SV as it is and was during BfA.And while I'm rather casual I think I'm performing really well. Reading this article gives me some hope. I'm glad my guild appreciates me playing SV. It'd be cool though if they made it into a Tank spec. I'd sooo dig that! (And then it'd be truelly a Survival.)
Why are so many people constantly so negative about the spec? I mean, like all the time, incl the writer of this post. If you people only want to play meta, why are you here to crush the spec in first place when you've decided to play something else anyway? Effing negative ppl all the time.I love the spec, I'm gonna main it on my main and yes I've got a raid spot and yes I've got a group for m+ as well. And no they won't ask me to change spec because they know I love the spec and that i think that meta should be destroyed (it destroys de fun of the game) And yes, the spec is great fun